| | | | | ...and Frank Luntz's focus group of undecided voters was very revealing. |
| | | | | well, I guess you few must be right, after all McCain will say you are *LOL* and we all know how on the ball he has been the last few years. Got an extra sand box, just in case he wants to talk to god?
"To know, is to know you know nothing." -Confucius |
| | | | | kasteele, a refresher for you.
I have nothing but contempt for you, your false "opinions" (which you boast of) and your made-up facts.
Generally, I simply ignore you.
...and I mean all of that in the nicest way.
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| | | | | From what we saw over here it was pretty much neck and neck....no heavyweight blows from either of them
Palin, well rehearsed and confident, a relief after her mumblings these last few weeks. Played down the green issues.
Biden, long winded, rehearsed and went on about Bush too much
Can't say either stood out, except Palin but only because she didn't come across as unprepared or floundering. That she was articulate and with t for once doesn't make her win by miles. It makes them level pegged in my opinion.
'The wit dried up years ago' |
| | | | | bree (10/2/2008)kasteele, a refresher for you. I have nothing but contempt for you, your false "opinions" (which you boast of) and your made-up facts. Generally, I simply ignore you. ...and I mean all of that in the nicest way.  
Another good one bree....
And I decided to just block kasteele weeks ago since he never adds anything to the discussion just a wannabe prick. I find the best way to reason with an attention seeker is to simply ignore them. The others at least add some cut and paste web links.
Capitalizm without failure...is like Religion without Hell.
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| | | | | speaking of Pakistan, Sarah Palin agrees with Barack Obama on Pakistan
McCain and company reeled her in on that one, so much for being a Maverick she duck the debate question about Pakistan last night when it was her turn too
I firmly believe, after watching Joe Biden won the debate last night, hands down.
So do these people.
According to CNN's National Poll of people who watched the debate.
51 % of those polled thought Biden did the best job in Thursday night's debate, while 36 % thought Palin did the best job.
A CBS Focus Group (the station I watched the debate on) of 473 uncommitted voters give Biden a significant edge: 46 percent say he won compared to 21 percent for Palin. Thirty-three percent said it was a tie. So add 16.5 to each person. Joe Biden 62.5 %, Palin 37.5%.
I especially liked the Neilsen Research technology that CBS showed that scans the faces for reactions of undecided voters and charts them. Very cool technology. When Joe and Sarah were debating Iraq Joe's graph peaked high, as soon as Sarah started with "You are waving the white flag of surrender", the chart went way down, indicating that the undecided voters in that room, like most Americans don't support the war in Iraq and want our troops to come home. That was a telltale moment in the debate last night.
It was also used by CNN.
Sarah Palin is touting the Surge, and America is apparently not that interested, according to CNN's reaction meter of Ohio uncommitted voters. Dial Line stays flat, flat, flat. Biden touts Obama's plan, the dial line shoots up. Especially at the idea of Iraqis taking responsibility. Women especially like the idea of the Iraqis spending their own money. Timetables get tepid support. Palin's accusation that Obama and Biden are waving the "white flag of surrender" sends the line plummeting.
Ex-Bush Officials: Biden Won the Debate
The consensus from the debate seems to be that while Sarah Palin exceeded the exceedingly low expectations set for her, Joe Biden won the night. The word comes from former members of the Bush administration and even John McCain's former press secretary.
Torie Clarke, who worked with McCain back in Arizona and with the Bush Administration's Department of Defense, had the following remarks on ABC:
"I'm so surprised at what we are talking about before and after the debate. Before the debate the speculation was all on Sarah Palin, how well can she do, can she answer the tough questions? Nobody was paying attention to Joe Biden. I think Joe Biden had his best night tonight. He came with one mission, and that was to go after John McCain, and he did it, backed up by facts. I think he did a better job tonight of tying McCain to the Bush administration than Obama did last week.
Matthew Dowd, who worked for George Bush's communications team while in the White House, followed Clarke and he too agreed that the Delaware Democrat took the evening.
"I think, you know, I agree with her on this. I think Sarah Palin did reasonably well. The death spiral she has been on for the last week, she survived. She's lived another day. She did well. But I think, when the polls come out in the next two, three days, Joe Biden won this debate."
There is no fear and ignorance Only greater understanding and awareness when we apply our intelligence and examine with our hearts and minds, what is truth |
| | | | | | LAM....i didn't watch any focus groups...i watched the debate...made my decisions myself...thinking for myself...and since i do think for myself...ask anyone that knows me*L* i was able to come to my opinion all on my own without having to watch any focus group...news report...or talk to anyone else....I may be a registered democrat, but that doesn't mean i won't vote republican....if that is who i believe is the right person for the job...no matter if they are male or female. I'm from the state of kansas....we have a female governor...who was in the group of people that Obama had considered for VP...i would have been ecstatic if he'd have chosen her |
| | | | | Sarah Palin had two hurdles to jump over in this debate. The first was the very low one of expectations. She remembered her lines, didn't babble incoherently (though she did ramble on a few times not even addressing the question) and didn't drool on herself. Mission accomplished.
The second hurdle was a little higher for most Amercians though and she didn't come close to jumping over it - the question of is she ready to be the President if required? And on that one, Well, I'll betcha *wink* most Amercians felt like I did. Gosh, there is no way this woman, bless her heart, is ready to sit at the head of the ole table with the the G7 or those Joint Chiefs of Staff and start makin' those war plans, let alone negotiate with any of our darn enemies and command their respect, doggone it! She might distract them by showing a little leg though. That worked for me.
Joe Biden was professional and his command of facts and policy showed he's been at this his whole life not just 5 weeks. He also trumped her in the sexism and I feel your pain areas in the most poignant moment of the debate with his emotional recollection of his wife's death and raising his sons as a single parent in response to her telling us how she gets it, 'cause, ya know, I'm a hockey mom!
The impartial poll results and most of the pundits gave it to Biden on points and substance, though in the end it won't change the direction of the tide that is rising against McCain. |
| | | | | hehe...by impartial I take it you mean those who support Obama.
Sarah Palin was the clear winner. Will the Palin Effect kick in again? We shall see in the coming days.
Those pollsters are so rude calling people at midnight! |
| | | | | Palin agrees with Obama on Pakistan that is until John McCain reeled her in
last night she ducked the Pakistan topic in the debate after Joe Biden discussed it we all know why 
As if Fox is not pro McCain/Palin hehehe
Friday, Oct. 03, 2008 Klein: Palin Was Fine, But This Debate Was No Contest By Joe Klein
She did fine, I suppose.
She was animated and confident. She displayed an ability, for the first time since her convention speech, to repeat with a fair amount of credibility, the formulations that her handlers had given her. You knew she was well prepared when practically the first words out of her mouth were, "Go to a kids' soccer game..." She had that folksy thing down—although I did notice, watching the squiggly lines down at the bottom of the CNN screen, that when she tried to get cutesy with her folksiness, it didn't work.
She also was allowed to do fine by Joe Biden, who never really challenged her—his criticisms were always directed at John McCain—and never exposed the obvious shallowness of her knowledge on most topics. (He must have been sorely tempted to correct Palin when she called David McKiernan, the commanding general in Afghanistan, "McLellan," but Biden was hard-wired—I imagine his debate prep was a form of electric shock therapy—not to correct her, attack her, disrespect her.)
Indeed, Sarah Palin's high-energy performance in the vice-presidential debate was the most glaring demonstration—since George W. Bush's performances in 2000—of how little you can get away with knowing and still survive one of these things, especially if the rules limit the cross-examination as severely as they did in this debate. Her relentless opacity was impressive. She refused to answer the questions where she hadn't been prepped with answers and when Biden pointed out that an early question had been on deregulation not taxes, she flashed: "I may not answer the questions the way you and the moderator want to hear, but I'm gonna talk straight to the American people."
Talk straight she didn't, with only a few exceptions. She talked talking points. And when the talking points concerned areas where she didn't know diddly, she didn't talk them very convincingly. Indeed, there were times I got the distinct impression that she didn't understand the points she was talking about (on the vice president's constitutional powers, for example).
Joe Biden, by contrast, demonstrated a real knowledge of the issues in question. He made several verbal fumbles—it was Syria, not Hizballah, that left Lebanon—and at times he lapsed into legi-speak, even using plague words like "amendments" and "Liheap" (the winter heating oil assistance program for poor people). But his was a solid, informed and restrained performance—although his best moments came near the end of the debate (when much of America had turned to the baseball playoffs or reruns of their favorite sitcoms on cable). He was genuinely moving when he talked about being a single parent after the death of his wife (he almost began to weep, but held it together); in fact, that moment was more real than anything Palin said all night. He also closed with a devastating point: McCain was, sure enough, a maverick on some things, but not on any of the issues that really mattered in this election—and he listed those issues, and where McCain stood on them, to great effect.
It was striking to me—for the second time in two debates—that the Democrat got much the better of the argument on Iraq, especially if you watched the squiggly focus group lines on CNN: it seems clear that people just want the war to end. Biden did marginally better than Obama on the substance of the issue, pointing out that the Maliki government agrees with Obama, not McCain, on the timetable to withdraw U.S. troops (which Obama failed to mention last Friday).
The fact that Palin made it through the debate without running off the stage shouting, "I can't do this!" should not obscure the fact that there was only one person tonight whom anyone with any sense—even John McCain, I imagine—would trust as President. Biden's performance was strong and, happily, gimmick free. He used no gotcha soundbites, no consultant-driven silliness—a fact driven home by the lameness of Palin's snark lines like, "Say it ain't so, Joe" and—pace, Gipper—"There you go again, talking about the past."
Palin's problem, and McCain's, is that the recent past is crucial in this election. Bush's decisions over the past eight years—to go to war in Iraq, to neglect the war in Afghanistan, to aggrandize the rich and neglect the middle class—created the dreadful moment this country faces right now, and people know that. Fearful for their futures and the nation's, they seem to be looking for something different—and that something involves steadiness, knowledge and some clear ideas about what to do going forward, qualities that Sarah Palin did not display tonight.
What she did show was some folksy charm and some energy—qualities that might get her selected for Dancing With the Stars, if not Jeopardy. But that's not enough to change the trajectory of this race, especially since nothing that was said in this debate will be remembered, or remarked upon, a week from now.
There is no fear and ignorance Only greater understanding and awareness when we apply our intelligence and examine with our hearts and minds, what is truth |
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